Despite playing drums for Crosby, Stills
& Nash for thirty years, Joe Vitale remains the invisible man.
His name appears in liner notes but never in lights. The lack of
fame does not bother Joe as he is more comfortable being a musician than a
Rock Star. He is most at home making music with other great
musicians -- and we are talking great musicians. Rick
Derringer, The Eagles, John Lennon, Zakk Wylde, Peter Frampton, Don Felder
and Joe Walsh are but a few of the legends of rock who have recorded or
shared the stage with Joe. Walsh, in fact, has been playing with
Vitale since the band Barnstormer. That’s Joe playing drums on “Rocky
Mountain Way,” “Life’s Been Good” and “Space Age Whiz Kids.”
For a complete list of all Joe have played with visit his website at
joevitaleondrums.com.
The list will drop your jaw.
Another rock icon that
was in a band with Joe is Ted Nugent. Uncle Ted met Vitale in Ohio
in 1971 but quickly moved him to Michigan and made him a member of The
Amboy Dukes. Nugent recalls, “In the whirlwind excitement of the
early nonstop jam days I was fortunate enough to run into many of the
world's most gifted musicians. Joe & I jammed & I fell in rockluv
with his soulful Funkbrother masterful drum grind. I had to have him. Joe
brought to the Amboy Dukes a continuing reverence for the soulful black
masters who drove our musical dreams with a depth of emotion, spirit,
attitude and piss & vinegar to keep the grooves as James Brown like as
possible.”
In addition to jamming
with Joe, Nugent took the drummer hunting, “Everybody who shares my
wonderful creative musical campfire will eventually be drawn into the
primal scream purity of my natural predator lifestyle to witness first
hand the outrageous intensity of ultimate hands-on independence &
emotion of the hunt. Like most rockers, Joe fumbled along with the
concrete jungle baggage, a bit too noisy & lacking sufficient stealth
to enter the domain of the beast undetected, but we certainly shared the
spirit of the wild.”
Eventually Vitale left
Nugent’s band to hit the studio with Joe Walsh. Nugent reflects on
Joe’s exit from The Amboy Dukes and on their friendship, “I don’t
remember the exact details of the moment of the split but I know that both
of us followed our hearts to pursue our American musical dreams with
clarity, integrity & passion. Not only are all my musicians masters of
their craft, but of equal importance, they are all good, decent, quality
men. I value the many friendships over the years and as we run into each
other here and there on the roads of America, it is always a joyful &
welcome homecoming of sorts. Joe is a great drummer and great American. He
is a Nugent BloodBrother.”
Jeb: I have to tell
you before we get started that I am a huge Joe Walsh fan.
Joe: That group made
more racket than any of the other groups I have ever played with in this
business. I have played with a lot of groups but wherever I go that
is what people want to talk about. I will tell you why. It is
because we played for the world. We went to every nook and cranny in
the country. We played every bar and every dive. We worked
over 300 days a year. We would play in Toledo and then the next
night we would play forty miles away and then the next night we would be
another forty miles away. We played in every little town in America.
Jeb: Barnstorm
is not as known as The Smokier You Drink The Player You Get but I
thought it was the best of the bunch.
Joe: It didn’t have
the number of sales but it had the integrity of a real band album.
It had the sounds of the time and maybe we were even a little bit ahead
musically. A lot of musicians moved to the Rocky Mountains back in
the early 1970's. We were there and so were Stephen Stills, Carl
Wilson and Dan Fogelberg. Tommy Bolin was from there as well.
Jeb: I have seen the
list of bands you have played with and there is only one I am not familiar
with. Who are The Chylds?
Joe: [laughter] You
would not know that. We actually did make the National Charts once.
I was 16 and still in high school. We were a band when the McCoy’s
were a band. Rick Derringer was from Ohio as well. We actually
got a record deal with Warner Brothers when we were 16. We
were a pretty good band. We wrote some of our own music and then we
did some cover songs. We were like a Beach Boy/Beatles band in that
we featured a lot of vocals. You can still find those singles once
in a while on eBay.
Jeb: What is up with
Crosby, Stills & Nash?
Joe: We just cancelled
our whole year. We may come back in the fall but we had to cancel
for now due to David Crosby having to have shoulder surgery. It is
an old injury that he aggravated – maybe from his motorcycle wreck.
It flared up to where he had to have surgery and rehab. They have
rescheduled the tour on the CSN website. We go to Australia and New
Zealand toward the end of the year. That is fine with me because it
will be spring down there. Crosby/Nash cancelled their tour as well
– that is why I was on the phone with Stephen when you called.
Next week I go out to LA
and start rehearsals with Stephen Stills. We are going to do several
dates together. We dug into the old catalog. We are going to
be doing a bunch of Manassas stuff. We are also going to be
playing some Buffalo Springfield and some of Stephen’s very early solo
work. We have to play some of the classics like “Southern Cross”
and “Helplessly Hoping.” Stephen’s catalog has an incredible
amount of beautiful songs. His two solo albums were really good.
He is such a gifted songwriter. A lot of people don’t realize that
he was very much responsible for the first CSN record. He is all
over that record and he played bass on it too. He sang a ton and he
did all the guitars. He is a very talented person.
Jeb: Your tenure with
Crosby, Stills & Nash is getting to be very lengthy.
Joe: If you just take
CSN then it has been thirty years. If you add Neil Young to it then
it is thirty-one years because I did the Stills/Young record. It was
a great record. We didn’t tour very much. We rehearsed for
three weeks and the tour only lasted two. In 1977 we did the CSN
record. That is the one with the guys on the boat. We had some
great songs on that one including “Dark Star,” and “Just a Song
Before I Go.”
Jeb: You have been
the invisible guy for thirty-one years! Still no Crosby, Stills,
Nash & Vitale.
Joe: That’s right.
That is fine with me. It is the way it is. It has never
bothered me. They have actually had several drummers over the years
because I played with Joe Walsh and others at the time. The guy I
would not want to be in that band is the bass player. They have been
through dozens of bass players. Because of this band, I have had the
chance to play with the best bass players in the world. Bass players
– I don’t know what it is but they would change them all the time.
Thank God they didn’t have the same theory with drummers.
Jeb: That may be a
testament to you.
Joe: There were a couple
of tours where I was already booked and they would call and tell me to
come on. Instead they would use Russ Kunkel or someone of his
caliber. CSN has always been that way. It really is a family
as far as the players go – it is just a really big family.
Jeb: You are probably
the closest person to that legendary group other than the three members
themselves.
Joe: I am very close to
it in a way not a lot of people know. After high school and a couple
of years of college I moved to Kent State University. That is where
all the shit came down and it is where the song came from. I
didn’t know the guys back then as it was 1969. I remember
listening to these tunes while all that shit was going down. All the
sudden I hear ‘four dead in Ohio.’ That went down in 1970.
It was pretty wild.
In 1971 I started with
Ted Nugent and in 1972 I started with Joe Walsh. Just a few years
later I was with Stills and Young and then Crosby, Stills & Nash.
It is quite a connection, really. Stephen had songs at that time
like “For What It’s Worth.” It was a hell of a time. I
try to tell young people what it was like. It was scary but it was
also a wonderful time to live. If you were a musician or you were
just into the music then it was a great time to live.
Jeb: How did you
first get the gig with Stephen?
Joe: Joe left The James
Gang in the fall of ‘71. Joe called me and asked me if I wanted to
move to Colorado and put a band together. I said, “Absolutely.”
I was in Detroit at the time working with Ted Nugent. I loved
working with Ted back then. He was a great rock n’ roller.
We would play a ton and then he would take a year off. I had to get
something more steady. Ted was very cool about it. He said,
“Go play with Joey.” I still talk to Ted all the time. He
is a good guy. I went to see him last year at one of his shows and
he just kicked ass.
We all moved to Colorado
and Stephen was already living there. He came and sat in with us on
one of our sessions. He had heard about this new band from back East
that had Joe Walsh from The James Gang in it. Stephen came to the
studio and watched us do some of the work for the Smoker album.
He was there when Joe did the vocal on “Rocky Mountain Way.” We
were just hanging out and we all became friends. Barnstorm started
to dissolve in 1975. We had run our course and Joe was thinking
about doing something different. Stephen told me that if I wasn’t
going to be playing with Joe anymore then I could come and play with his
band.
When I got there, he
said, “I’ve got some news for you. We are going to do an album
with Neil Young.” I was thrilled. We were all in our
twenties at the time. If you listen to that record then you will be
surprised as it is really good. I don’t listen to a lot of the
records that I have played on – I just don’t. It is always cool
when you are driving in the car and a classic rock station plays something
on the radio that you played on and you kind of forgot about. You
can realize what a cool song it was. If you listen to all the
records you were on over and over than that is kind of vain. I just
don’t do it. I am satisfied with my performance on records that I
have made.
I will admit that if you
do go back and listen to an entire album that you did at the time that you
have not listened too in ages then you realize that the album really was a
well-thought out thing. I get that feeling when I listen to the
Stills/Young album. It really is a good record. We didn’t
have David and Graham. We just had Stephen, Neil, the bass player,
George Perry, and the percussionist, Joe Lala and myself. There was
one other guy – a keyboard player. We all did the harmonies and we
did the background vocals. It was a very band oriented project.
It was not like we did the backing tracks and they said, “Okay, you guys
go away now. Stephen and I will finish this.” Neil was like,
“You guys go out there and sing.”
Jeb: How did you
manage two fill time gigs at the same time with Crosby, Stills & Nash
and Joe Walsh?
Joe: I had three things
going on at one point in time. I was doing CSN and the Eagles at the
same time. During a small break, Joe and I went over to England and
did the John Entwistle album. We were busy. We were big fans
of the Who and we had done a lot of shows with them at one time.
Working with him was really a lot of fun.
Jeb: You earned the
right to play with these legends of music. Did you then or do you
now ever look back and say, “Holy shit, look who I have played with.”
Joe: It is kind of
weird. I guess I do. Having played with some monster acts
early in my career really was amazing. I look back on that and it is
really precious to me. Now I am just an old guy who does this for a
living [laughter].
I played with Peter
Frampton in 1977 and 1978. They had a problem with their drummer and
I took over for him on the Frampton Comes Alive World Tour. That
tour blew my mind. We had seen some pretty big crowds with Barnstorm
and with Crosby, Stills & Nash but Peter Frampton’s tour was a
mega-tour. We were playing football stadiums. We played
Soldiers Field in Chicago and it was completely sold out. There were
over eighty thousand people. Looking back now I am glad that I was
not nervous. Looking back now I am in awe of a crowd that size.
I am not saying that back then I had bigger balls. I think it was
just attitude. It was not arrogance. We were just like, “We
are a rock n’ roll band so let’s get out there and play.” Now
I would be scared to death to look out there and see a crowd like that.
Well, not now because I have done this so long. But when you are in
your twenties and that crowd is all looking at you, waiting for you to
count off – they are waiting for you to start the show. It is kind
of weird. It is not that it was nothing because we were so cool.
It was not that at all. We were just so big that we just thought,
“This is just another gig. There are more people here today.”
I am more impressed with the thought of it now then I was then. We
were not jaded or impressed; we just thought it was cool.
The first gig I did with
Frampton, Steve Miller opened for us. It was in Arrowhead Stadium, right
in your neck of the woods. It was a daytime concert and Steve Miller
paid ten thousand dollars to bring his laser light show with him. A
lot of good the lights did him when he played in the daylight. It
was a great Spinal Tap moment.
Jeb: I am going to
throw out some things you have done and you just tell about it.
First off tell me how you hooked up with the Amboy Dukes?
Joe: I was playing in
Kent, Ohio in a bar. Kent State was really a cool college.
There was a ton of bands. We could play there four to five times a
week. Kent State had a reputation for great bands. I think The
James Gang did that. Here is how it went: Cleveland was a huge place
for music. Everyone who toured came through Cleveland. Ted
Nugent played there and after the show he heard about this town where Joe
Walsh was playing. This was the late ‘60's and it was the thing to
do. Ted came into this club where I was playing and he came up to me
and asked me if I would like to come up to Detroit and play in his band.
I said, “When are we leaving?” I left right then and I went up
to his house for a couple of days and we played together and he hired me.
I really could tell then
that Ted Nugent was a super trooper. He loves playing and he loves
music. He has that wonderful old time Rock n’ Roll Detroit
Attitude. There was a lot more coming out of Detroit than Motown.
There were Ted Nugent and the Amboy Dukes and Iggy Pop and Mitch Ryder and
the Detroit Wheels. Ted was a real clean-cut guy. He was very
anti-drug and alcohol back then. He still looks great and he still
plays great. I could even tell back then that this guy was not going
away. I remember that he took me hunting a few times. I was
not very good at it. Ted is a real true American guy. He is
his own person and he thinks what he thinks and he does what he wants.
Jeb: You have also
played with Michael Stanley a lot. He never got the respect he
deserved.
Joe: You couldn’t make
that statement in these parts. He is huge in Ohio. He is a
local celebrity and a local star. He is a disc jockey at a Cleveland
radio station. He still has the band and he still plays.
We put that band
together through Bill Szymczyk. Bill put the Eagles together along
with everyone else back then. If you look at the people on the first
Michael Stanley record you can tell that Bill just got all of his friends
together to come play. Bill still works with Michael and they still
make records. Michael didn’t break out of the area like I thought
he would. A lot of people know who he is but they don’t realize
how many records he has made.
Jeb: Did you know
Rick Derringer?
Joe: I knew Rick back in
the 60's. The Childs opened for The McCoy’s.
Jeb: You played on
his album All American Boy. You don’t just pick any album
to play on. You always are on the best.
Joe: I have been on some
great records. Some of them have turned into real classics. I
look at a lot of different people’s resumes and see who they played with
and then I look at mine and I have to admit it is pretty deep. I
don’t know how it all happened. I am not just on one style of
record; I am on several styles. I was just fortunate to run into the
right people at the right time. I must have done something musically
that made them want me on their record. I have been very fortunate.
Jeb: What is the
difference between working in the studio with Rick Derringer or Ted Nugent
verses Joe Walsh?
Joe: When either of
those guys picks up a guitar they don’t even need a drummer. When
they start jamming you just need to start playing along as it is already
there. They are two different guys personally but the similarities
lie in their abilities and versatilities. They write totally
different songs as well. Those guys are not just guitar players;
they are great guitar players. They have something that other guys
don’t have. There are a lot of guys who are really good but they
are just missing something. I think it is a signature style that
makes musicians stand out. Joe Walsh has that rhythm/lead stuff at
the same time. Joe Perry is good at that too. Jeff Beck is
another one. Jimmy Page and Jimi Hendrix are like that. You
can tell a Hendrix solo from a mile away.
What makes these guys
different is creative vision. Everyone is totally different in the
way they write and the way they want their songs to be heard. When
you hear Rick Derringer or Ted Nugent there is just a fire going on.
One thing that I have learned from playing with great players like that is
that you have to find out who you are and you have to find out what is
unique to you only. That is what makes you stand out. You have
to find out what you do best and you have to stick with it.
Jeb: I noticed an
album on your discography that I have never listened to. It is from
1976 and it is called Roller Coaster Weekend by Joe Vitale.
Joe: [laughs] That is a
great album. Do you know I have Rick Derringer and Joe Walsh on
there? The second album I did I had Walsh and Don Felder play on it.
I had been with the Eagles and I played with Felder.
Jeb: It is fun to
hear you just nonchalantly mention that you were with the Eagles.
Joe: Well, that was my
job back in 1979 and 1980. I don’t say that lightly. It was
a great time. I don’t know how to phrase it but I don’t look at
myself as that I did something so special. I look at it like this is
what I have been put on this earth to do so it is my job. I have
been fortunate to land some nice jobs.
Jeb: How did you land
all these different gigs?
Joe: A common thread
through all of this is Bill Szymczyk. Bill was a producer and he put
these musicians together to make records. He pulls them in and then
he notices who does what and who plays well and who comes up with good
ideas in the studio. It is all networking. It is what MySpace
does now. One leads to two, two leads to four, four leads to eight.
Bill had a lot to do with that. You ought to see his Wall of Shame.
He has Gold and Platinum records that I didn’t even know he produced.
He had a team of
musicians of about twenty people. He would put them together in
several different combinations. I got quite a bit of depth in my
discography because of Bill. I went from record to record back in
those days. Irving Azoff managed a whole ton of people including Joe
Walsh. One thing led to another and you would just get a phone call
in the middle of the night and off you would go on a plane the next day.
I actually had to turn down some projects that I wanted to do. I had
to turn down the Beach Boys on their classic record Surfs Up.
I was very good friends with Carl Wilson. I had to turn down a Walsh
record. I played on every one on every one of his records except The
Confessor. I was deep into Crosby, Stills & Nash stuff.
I believe we were working with Neil at the time. I think it was the American
Dream album. I had committed to do that up at Neil’s ranch.
I am really sorry I missed that record. I think Jeff Porcaro might
have been on that record.
Jeb: Did you ever
record with John Lennon?
Joe: I did record with
John Lennon. He used to have these Sunday night jams at the Record
Plant in LA. Joe and I got called into do this. Ronnie Wood,
Ringo, David Bowie and all these other great players were there.
Every Sunday we would go to the Record Plant and start taping around
Midnight. Nobody knew we were doing this. We would work until
about five or six in the morning. John was just trying out a lot of
new tunes. We did this for a month straight. We were sworn to
secrecy. This was a Beatle and not only was he a Beatle he was THAT
Beatle. Some asshole from the studio said something and it got out.
The forth Sunday we recorded together we walked out of the studio at about
five in the morning and there were five thousand people waiting for us.
Lennon jumped in his car and split and that was the end. I have no
idea what happened to those tapes but somebody must have them. They
were not master tapes because we were not running two inch tape. We
were just running quarter inch tape because he was trying out new tunes.
I have to tell you that they were just killer. He might have been
doing demos or maybe he was just wanting to record with guys he wanted to
play with. They were just stereo tapes but when we played them back
they sounded good.
Jeb: Were you just
jamming?
Joe: No, we were playing
songs. They were original songs. Some of them were okay but
some of them were just killer.
Jeb: I loved the Joe
Walsh album You Bought It You Name It.
Joe: That was a great
album. It did not even go Gold but if you listen to it then you will
realize that is was pretty darn good. The single, “Space Age Whiz
Kids” was our way of saying, “What the hell are you doing? Come
on!” Back then there was Pong and Asteroids. We made a video
for MTV for that song and it was just horrible. It was so cheap but
it was wonderfully cheap. Back then people were bitching that it was
going to cost $25,000 to make a video. Now you spend that much a
minute to make a video.
Jeb: I loved “The
Worry Song.”
Joe: Oh, “The Worry
Song.” That was with Waddy Wachtel on guitar. We recorded that on
the Catalina Islands which is about twenty-five miles off of Long Beach,
California. We took all of our gear over there to a big ballroom.
They guys that owned the ballroom said that we could record for free in
the ballroom if we would play a free concert for them at the end of two
weeks. We said, “Done.” “The Worry Song” was recorded
there. It was a really cool song.
Jeb: “I.L.B.T.’s”
was the cornerstone of the album. [I Like Big Tits]
Joe: That was the
college campus hit. I have seen a video of it on the internet.
It is just horrible. It is not on YouTube but it is in there
somewhere. If I find a cut of it then I will email it to you.
Jeb: You also worked
with Father Guido Sarducci.
Joe: Joe and I did a
Christmas song with him. I still see action on that every Christmas.
It is called “Santa’s Lament” and it is a funny, funny piece of
music. We worked in the studio with him. He hung out with us
for three or four days. We had a ball with him as he is a funny guy.
He is a nut.
Jeb: Getting back to
the modern day, are Crosby, Stills & Nash going to be making any new
music?
Joe: Stephen is going to
be putting a record out pretty soon. Neil records an album every
year. He is always recording and he has tons of material that is
already recorded but has never been released. Crosby/Nash might do
another record too. As far as the three guys go, they need to write
some songs together and get back in the studio. They are really due.
Jeb: How is David
Crosby doing?
Joe: He is a walking
miracle. He had a liver transplant in 1994 and he is doing well.
He is breaking all the odds. He is singing great these days.
He gets tired after a long haul on the road but he is a hell of a trooper.
He loves being in a band. He is still going strong even after all
the brutal things his heath went through. He is singing very good
right now. He has not lost any chops on his vocals.
Jeb: You can love
music and you can love drugs and booze. Fortunately, David seems to
love music more than chemicals. Not everyone has made that choice.
Joe: They don’t end up
choosing it either. A lot of people went through a lot of shit and
then realized that this is not what they really wanted to do and they get
back to the music. Most, we hope, do that but some don’t.
They die. David has kept himself together. He is on a serious
health kick now because he has really beat the odds. Joe has done
the same thing. He is a recovering alcoholic. He is completely
on top of it now. He works out and he is a health nut. We all
went through a pretty weird time. Those years saw some serious
changes take place in the music business and in the world. Joe was
the king of partying and now he has turned his life around. I sat in
with The James Gang when they played in Ohio. I remember seeing them
in 1969 and he has changed so much. When you drink, your voice is
the first thing to go. Joe is now singing as strong as he did in
1969. The Eagles certainly have a lot to do with that as they demand
excellence. You have got to maintain your chops to play in that
band. You will have to read my book that is coming out. It is
about 35 years on the road. I have hilarious stories and thousands
of pictures. I am finishing it up.
Jeb: Tell me about
working in the studio with Bill Szymczyk.
Joe: Bill is not a
musician. He hears music and he is just a great record maker.
He is not a songwriter but he can put songs together. He is not a
lyricist but he can help put lyrics together. He can really make
great records. You have to do all of that to be a great producer but
there is another half that you have to do in order to be a great producer
and make great records. His nickname is Coach and that says it all.
He forms a team and he gets the team working as one. George Martin
did that with the Beatles, he got them thinking as one. Sometimes
you are in the studio and you have great ideas and you know what to do.
Other times you are in the studio and you don’t know what to do with a
certain part of a song. Bill always jumps in there and helps . If
you had a four-piece band then with Bill, you had a five-piece band.
He would jump in there and say, “Here is what I think we should do. Go
back to the toms that you were doing in the verse.” He was always
right. That is what a producer is.
Jeb: Have you ever
worked with Paul Rodgers?
Joe: No, I would love to
work with Paul but timing was not in our favor. Talking with Chris
Crawford, Paul’s manager – we are friends, he has been to several CSN
shows and I have been to tons of Paul’s shows. He has one of the
best voices in rock n’ roll in the whole world. There is really
none better. I would love to work with him. We are trying to
fit our schedules together so we can someday.
I would love to get into
the studio with Paul. I have worked with people like that before and
they really bring a lot out of me. I would love to play live with
him. I would love to play all those Bad Company, Free and the Firm
songs. I tried to hook Joe, Paul and myself up together to make an
album but getting all of our schedules together is hard. People have
commitments and contracts and all the bullshit. To do
something like that would take a year. You would want to do an album
and book a tour -- maybe someday. Joe and him did get together and
played some. I know Joe really loves him.
Jeb: Besides
the Stephen Still touring what else are you currently up to?
Joe: I am
finishing my album, Speaking in Drums and producing my son's album,
Joe Vitale Jr. Both will be out this summer. You can
check out Speaking in Drums at my MySpace
site. You also need to check out Joe
Vitale Jr's official site and you can hear his music by
clicking on his MySpace.
Jeb: Last one: One
name jumped off your biography and really did not fit with the other
artists. Zakk Wylde.
Joe: I don’t know of a better heavy metal guitar player in the world.
There are tons of heavy metal cats but Zakk is in a league of his own.
Crosby, Stills & Nash’s manager, for a short time, managed Zakk when
he was with Ozzy. Zakk wanted to do a Southern Rock record.
Management called me and the bass player from Alice in Chains and we went
into the studio with Zakk and recorded Book of Shadows. That
record is so good it is ridiculous. I was so proud to be on that
record. Zakk was a great guy to work with an he was an outstanding
player. He would come into the studio with so much energy it was
amazing. If you were down or a little tired then he had you ready to
rip in five minutes. Get in the car and crank that record up.
Jeb: Plus you never
had to worry about running out of beer when you are in the studio with
Zakk.
Joe: Are you kidding?
Beer stock went up when we were recording that album.
